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Green Room - Week 3 - Day 11

There is voting happening - http://therealljidol.livejournal.com/876790.html although not the voting that was originally planned.

For those keeping track at home - (if my scrolling over technique worked) There were 15 entries in the Friends (the entire Team Ocelot took a bye!) and 28 entries in the Rivals!


In yesterday's Green Room I was reminded of something - Idol is a really diverse group. Always has been. I hope it always will be.

I think there have been, and continue to be, dangers of too many people who share the same opinions on things - but hopefully human nature will prevail and we will never go too far down that route.

What I like is taking all of these people with different lives and throwing them in the same room together and see what happens!

There have been times when it's been explosive! There have been times when there was just a spark or two and everyone came to understand each other over time. Each has it's uses.

Heck, there have been times when those forces have been directed against me - sometimes I've responded well and other times "not so well". Because at the end of the day, we're still people and are going to have our good days and bad ones.

That's not just for the people responding either - some days those sharing their ideas aren't at their best at getting across what they actually mean and end up coming across like the jerks! It happens. I've seen it. I know you have as well.

There's a lesson in there somewhere about common humanity bringing us together to discuss how to treat subgroups and individuals. If you locate it, please bring it to the lost and found!


I keep having these random memory glitches where I have come across something and say "That should be in the Green Room", but when the time comes I keep putting it off until I forget the context.

In this particular case, there was an article that I saw someone share that keeps pinging in my head - (paraphrasing) it said that white cis-males needed to stop writing and/or trying to get published so that non-white cis-male voices could be heard.

I've started to type my own feelings about it, but as a white cis-male, I may be a little biased. ;)

In thinking about it though, I did think it was funny that I had set aside my own writing to concentrate on creating a community that encouraged the writing of so many diverse voices. It wasn't intentional, to gather diverse groups here, but I'm really glad that it happened.


( 55 comments — Leave a comment )
Dec. 29th, 2015 01:51 pm (UTC)
I know how you feel, Gary. For many years my own writing has taken a back seat to my literary magazine, Wild Violet (http://www.wildviolet.net).

One thing my Mom's sudden death has taught me, though, is not to put things off, either good or bad. So I will be self-publishing another poetry book early thus year.
Dec. 29th, 2015 02:07 pm (UTC)
I have a little bitterness toward the Old White Dudes' Club in spec fic/sci-fi/whatever genres. I don't think forcing cis white dudes to stop writing/publishing is the answer. Getting some of them (not you) to shut up once in a while would be nice, though.
Dec. 29th, 2015 06:59 pm (UTC)
I am with you on both counts. I don't like discrimination, of any sort. I just think there needs to be a more level playing field. I can't say how that should come about, but I also don't believe having one group become silent is the right direction.

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Dec. 29th, 2015 02:39 pm (UTC)
Obviously I'm not hanging out in the areas where a statement like that exists. First I've heard of it.

:retreats to the Super Seekrit Kizzy Bubble:

ETA: We saw the Doctor Who Christmas Special in a theater last night. If you've seen it, I'd love your thoughts on it.

Edited at 2015-12-29 02:41 pm (UTC)
Dec. 29th, 2015 04:03 pm (UTC)
Watched it at home last night and rather liked it - fresh blast of humor after Series 9 got dark.
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Dec. 29th, 2015 02:46 pm (UTC)
Had to look up what the term "white cis-male" meant.

I am sitting here feeling very old. When I was young the common plea was to abolish labels, and labeling people. It seems, today, that identity is achieved through labels, and that without a label one cannot be fully identified or realized. But I find myself reacting to the need for a label in what (today) might be termed, at best, a rebellious way. I don't want to be labeled. I don't need to publicly define myself to the degree where nothing is personal, or private. And to be honest, I don't feel the need to identify the people around me through a series of extensive labels. I'm far more interested in getting to know who a person is through contact and over time. A person is not an apartment. Tell me your name, and let's get to know each other over coffee, through conversation, not from scanning an ever-expanding list of acronyms...please.

As for anyone ever having to deny, or have denied, an expression of talent or interest to give some other person a chance for expression, I don't buy it. It is not the individual who should sacrifice their best effort to allow someone else whose best effort is yet to be determined a chance. This doesn't result in a level playing field, or even a more level playing field. It hasn't in the past, and it's unlikely to in the future. It is up to the publishers, the producers, and those whose job it is to award and reward the talent to cast a wider net, to reach beyond the established, the norm, the familiar. Never do less than your best! And never expect less than the best from those with whom you compete. I was taught that throwing a winning hand in order to let someone else win, or have a chance at winning, is just another way of cheating. Besides, isn't it pretty condescending to do that? Doesn't it just reek of bad faith, discrimination, and holier-than-thou-ism?
Dec. 29th, 2015 03:06 pm (UTC)
We were having a discussion last night (in regard to a book review that brought up the subject) about how kids are now being taught to "interpret the text" in their reading with "How would this make you feel?" rather than a discussion directly about the characters and their actions, because it increases their empathy and ability to put themselves into the situation.

I definitely remember the push to do away with labels - and have seen that boomerang back to the "I want to be labeled correctly!" movement. Both groups were trying to accomplish the same "sort of thing" of "I just want to be treated as an equal". But two very different thought processes are involved.

I won't say "people are more Me-focused" these days, because while I do find some truth in it, I think there is something that sounds like I'm saying that's totally a bad thing and I don't think that it is. I think there are problems with it, and ones that as as culture we are only starting to see... and I think there are some really good things about it, and the benefits that are only starting to show.

Besides, it makes me sound like I need to be chasing those damn kids off my lawn when I say it, and I don't want those kids to see me coming!! ;)

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Dec. 29th, 2015 03:44 pm (UTC)
Completely unrelated to this week's greenroom, because I'm behind on everything due to the holidays...

In a previous greenroom, Gary, you said:

"More to the point, how do you take this new term and find a way to get the heart of it into something that's authentically you? After all, that is what you are doing - putting YOU down on a page for other people to experience."

I was feeling a little out of my league with this whole competition - I'm not a writer, I'm a storyteller - and when I saw this whole list of foreign (to me) terms I just went "I can't do this. I can't just think of things to write, how do people even DO THAT."

But then someone who knows I am a beekeeper told me that one of them was about bees. Beekeeping is not just something I do, it's something I Am.

Putting ME down onto the page, through talking about my ladies, was one of the easiest things I've ever done.

Your words hit home in a big way, and have inspired me to keep on doing this thing, to look for the ME in every new topic that comes up now.

So thank you!

Dec. 29th, 2015 04:19 pm (UTC)
I'm really glad to hear that. Because I think that's a "basics" approach that is often lost in the crowd of "THIS IS HOW TO WRITE!" that you end up hearing.

Technique can be learned.

The old cliche is "Write What You Know", but IMO, that's not quite right: It's *write who you are*.

It doesn't matter if it's a non fiction piece about what you had for breakfast or a science fiction saga spanning the galaxy *you* need to be in there. When you aren't, people can feel it. I'm just not going to be brought into it if there is no emotional connection/no reason to actually care about what is going on.

You have the authenticity of being who you are.... that's kind of where people are coming from when they say they don't want to read the same "cis-white male perspectives". Not just that the characters aren't diverse, it's that the perspective itself isn't - and that's something you can't really fake.

Honestly, I'd rather read an entry full of grammar mistakes where I come away going "they really believe in this" than a technically perfect one where I walk away saying "and?"
(no subject) - misfitmanor - Dec. 29th, 2015 07:37 pm (UTC) - Expand
Dec. 29th, 2015 05:09 pm (UTC)
a few flagrant and flatulent thoughts
WEll, it looks like today, on the fifth day of Christmas FIVE GOLDEN RINGS and it looks like we are starting to REcover from the madness and take a breath between Xmas the orgy of consumer family madness and NewYears the ReBirth of HOPE it looks like we are thinking as we traditionally seem to do "these days" between the 25th of Decems and the 1st of Janus We Are Thinking of What HAD gone and HAS gone before and maybe just wonder What Might Come from "All of This" oh yes
I am Happy. Happy to read the thoughts. Your thoughts.
The gremlin green room is full of delicious thoughts this morning. So early in the day and already so many ruminations in the room oh my interweb friends once again you are making my day
Darnit I look at what I am writing and think I sound so freaking facecious but I am honest I swear on a stack of fat golden finger rings set out in clusters of five by five that once again each and every one of you have made my day just by typing into this converse-station.
I remember lables. I remember turnon tunein dropout. I remember me me me and then encounter groups falling down on the grass outside of class don't worry someone will catch you we all need to support each other I remember oh no you have to help your sister brother I remember competition and sharing. I remember she/he. I have read THE DISPOSSESSED by Ursula K Leguin seven times and wish I could make it into a movie I remember remembering memorable memories and I remember me when I was very young and I remember me remembering when I was very young and then I had a child and he is much better than I thank you God
See I told you I was looking facecious today but I am serious
Our fearless leader is right. We are many. Different.
Dec. 29th, 2015 05:43 pm (UTC)
RE: a few flagrant and flatulent thoughts
But still the same, as we were, as one another, as we remember. Not facetious, never facetious, though sometimes playful. Yes?
Dec. 29th, 2015 05:27 pm (UTC)
"Write who you are..." Yes! This!
Dec. 29th, 2015 06:54 pm (UTC)
If you would like a non-poll alphabetized list of entries, I have created one here:

Submitted For Your Convenience

I tend to want this sort of thing when I'm reading, so if I'm going to make it, I might as well share it. I was up very late last night (I slept less than 2 hours) trying to distract myself from stressing over a sudden and unexpected family emergency. This was very helpful, and I'm glad to have you benefit from it.

If you're at all the praying or sending positive energy sort, I'm sure my household could use some love right about now, and so could our family member in the hospital.
Dec. 29th, 2015 07:19 pm (UTC)
Prayer prayed.

Thank you for doing and sharing this. It will help me for sure.
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Dec. 29th, 2015 08:43 pm (UTC)
Somehow I'm not shocked my entire team took a bye.

Today's the first day I've had more than an hour just to sit down with my laptop. Far as I know, everyone else on the team was busy too. Oh, holidays.
( 55 comments — Leave a comment )


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