?

Log in

No account? Create an account

Last Episode | Next Episode

Green Room - Week 21 - Weekend Edition

I'm glad that you guys are behaving this week. Otherwise I'd have to tell you to go find me a switch!

Given that it's the weekend, I'm sure that the line between those who have heard the Adrian Peterson news and those who haven't is probably tipping over into the line of "haven't".

There are going to be plenty of discussions in the coming days and weeks about the actual case. (Unless there is something else that comes down the news pipeline before this one can take hold in the public dialogue) Heck, *actual details* are probably going to emerge in the actual case. (there is already some out there, but I'm sure there will be more)

It's been interesting seeing the responses online to this already though - there seems to be a line between those who believe all corporal punishment is child abuse and those who think that they spanking is a valid form of discipline.

I've definitely lived through both - and never really viewed "get the paddle"/"belt"/"switch" (I don't recall ever being hit with a wooden spoon. Although apparently my Grandmother was known for it) the same as the times I was punched or thrown across the room. In my particular case, those always seemed to be coming from different places.

Then again, is that the "cycle of violence"? Or IS there a difference and a line between the two?

***
and with that, I will link to my own form of abuse: The poll that is currently open: http://therealljidol.livejournal.com/778354.html

The new topic: http://therealljidol.livejournal.com/779089.html and the Work Room that goes with it: http://therealljidol.livejournal.com/779320.html

But it's only because I love you!*

(*Note: Not really)

Comments

( 104 comments — Leave a comment )
Page 1 of 2
<<[1] [2] >>
theun4givables
Sep. 13th, 2014 04:21 pm (UTC)
Fiiiiiiiiiiiiirst :D

Hi, GR. :3
roina_arwen
Sep. 13th, 2014 04:22 pm (UTC)
Hellooooooo there! Happy First!
(no subject) - theun4givables - Sep. 13th, 2014 04:28 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 04:22 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - theun4givables - Sep. 13th, 2014 04:29 pm (UTC) - Expand
roina_arwen
Sep. 13th, 2014 04:21 pm (UTC)
As is my wont, I'm not up on the news and have no clue who this dude is. However, I will say that (as not-a-parent but as a person who works with Child Protection) that a swat or two to the behind with a bare hand is definitely not the same as using a paddle or belt/switch. Just my .02 cents.
clauderainsrm
Sep. 13th, 2014 04:34 pm (UTC)
It's interesting to see how those lines of "what is OK" and "what is not OK" have changed so drastically in the matter of a couple generations.
(no subject) - roina_arwen - Sep. 13th, 2014 04:44 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:07 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:16 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - wolfden - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:23 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:24 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - wolfden - Sep. 13th, 2014 06:25 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:26 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:31 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 13th, 2014 06:52 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 07:05 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - roina_arwen - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:43 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - clauderainsrm - Sep. 13th, 2014 06:08 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - roina_arwen - Sep. 13th, 2014 06:33 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 13th, 2014 06:50 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 07:08 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - roina_arwen - Sep. 13th, 2014 07:26 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dmousey - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:47 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 07:07 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - roina_arwen - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:44 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - adoptedwriter - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:11 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - adoptedwriter - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:05 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:15 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - eska818 - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:30 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:34 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - roina_arwen - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:47 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - adoptedwriter - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:04 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dmousey - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:28 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - theun4givables - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:36 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dmousey - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:49 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 11:43 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - reckless_blues - Sep. 13th, 2014 10:00 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 11:43 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - millysdaughter - Sep. 15th, 2014 03:32 pm (UTC) - Expand
beeker121
Sep. 13th, 2014 04:44 pm (UTC)
Good morning. I am reserving comment on the whole Adrian Peterson thing until we know more, which I realize could probably get me kicked off the internet.

Instead I'm going to a college football game today with friends, where I'm sure the topic will never come up either. heh.

eska818
Sep. 13th, 2014 05:17 pm (UTC)
I don't think that spanking is necessarily abuse - but I do think there ends up being a fine line. If a child is being physically abused (like your example of being thrown across a room) I think the spankings can end up becoming part of the abuse, and often escalate.

Personally, I don't see the point in spanking. I don't think it achieves the things that parents want it to if they choose spanking as their method of discipline. The times I think spanking might be necessary are moments when a child is doing something that is possibly life threatening - and generally only when a child is a toddler, and unable to understand a verbal discussion of why something is dangerous. I spanked my daughter when she was around two for trying to run out into the street when a car was coming. My only hope was that she would connect the spanking and the behavior and not want to repeat it.

In the end, I'm a fan of positive reinforcement, and I think it fosters a better relationship between parent and child. I've seen the spanking method go wrong for a lot of parents (thinking of my brother and his children specifically). However - if that's how some parents want to discipline their kids, to each their own.
theun4givables
Sep. 13th, 2014 05:51 pm (UTC)
Fine line, definitely. My son, who at almost 5 is barely considered verbal (he does understand a lot of spoken instruction, and can communicate needs/wants and is starting to understand small exchanges), very rarely gets "popped one," as we refer to it. It's usually a swift smack, just enough to get his attention, and used just for that -- to get his attention. Once his attention is on me, he is usually focused enough to understand what I'm saying and has his own ways of indicating he understands.

But those smacks were only in response to severely dangerous situations (running into the street, running out of the house without permission, climbing out of my bedroom window to play on the small patch of roof -- which is a good 10-15ft off the ground and not very big, and he's highly adventurous and generally fearless), and as he's gotten older, they've occurred less and less. Especially as he's settled into our new home and his new routine.

Positive reinforcement tends to work best with him, though. Considering the child is sitting on my shoulders right now, I don't think the few instances of a smack have impaired my relationship with him. :) I just have to learn how to curb his desire to be up high. Because he loves being up high.
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 11:47 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - theun4givables - Sep. 14th, 2014 01:39 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - roina_arwen - Sep. 13th, 2014 05:52 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - halfshellvenus - Sep. 13th, 2014 06:49 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - adoptedwriter - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:02 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 13th, 2014 11:50 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - halfshellvenus - Sep. 14th, 2014 05:42 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 14th, 2014 08:51 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dmousey - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:21 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - halfshellvenus - Sep. 14th, 2014 05:46 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dmousey - Sep. 14th, 2014 12:26 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - theun4givables - Sep. 14th, 2014 01:42 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - theun4givables - Sep. 14th, 2014 01:40 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dmousey - Sep. 13th, 2014 08:37 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - clauderainsrm - Sep. 13th, 2014 06:11 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - roina_arwen - Sep. 13th, 2014 07:29 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dmousey - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:25 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 14th, 2014 09:00 am (UTC) - Expand
wolfden
Sep. 13th, 2014 05:46 pm (UTC)
I may have accidentally pissed off a bunch of locals on a local radio station fb page by disagreeing with the statement that he should be able to "discipline his son however he sees fit." If you are leaving marks that last for days that's not discipline that crosses the line to abuse.

(I don't really care I pissed them off either - the whole if you beating your kid is the only way thing annoys me.)

I am not really a fan of spanking. But that doesn't matter because this, this isn't just he spanked his kid (with a bare hand) on the butt. This reads like abuse to me. Peterson even said he hit the child with a switch 10-15 times. That he didn't realize the switch was wrapping around and hitting the child's thigh. The article I read said the child had defensive wounds on his hands and open wounds on his legs and marking in multiple places including his testicles. That is abuse.

I was spanked growing up (born in 1973) with a bare hand, a wooden spoon, fly swatter and willow switch. I never ended up with marks like being described. I don't think spanking taught me to mind. It taught me to not get caught and it taught me to lie and it taught me to fear.



dmousey
Sep. 14th, 2014 02:31 am (UTC)
As a child I had to hide my belt marks on thighs and back. My father told me the police would come and take me away. He took us out once and started walking up the block, when we asked where we were going he said the Police Station, I pulled my brother back a bit and let my dad get about four, five steps ahead, then It's grabbed my brother and ran down an alley. I was 7, my brother 6, we ended up in foster care anyway.
halfshellvenus
Sep. 13th, 2014 06:45 pm (UTC)
I was spanked (with a bare hand) probably 3 times as a kid, and was mortified just by being bad enough to get spanked. It was always for something big.

Being moderate in most things, I am not against swatting if used rarely, and depending on the child. But frequent corporal punishment just teaches children to fear and mistrust.

The only children who regularly misbehave are those who have other issues (where a doctor/therapist should be consulted), or who are really oppositional/defiant... in which case you need some different parenting techniques to figure out how to work with them.

Apart from that, if you imagine that your children are misbehaving a lot, you may be a rageaholic or control freak-- or both.

Beatings that leave marks? That's going too far, though people usually model the parenting they grew up with, and there's a long tradition of those methods in certain regions.
n3m3sis43
Sep. 14th, 2014 09:03 am (UTC)
"The only children who regularly misbehave are those who have other issues (where a doctor/therapist should be consulted), or who are really oppositional/defiant or three year olds"

There, I fixed it for you. :)


Edited at 2014-09-14 09:03 am (UTC)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus - Sep. 14th, 2014 04:37 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 14th, 2014 04:41 pm (UTC) - Expand
bleodswean
Sep. 13th, 2014 06:49 pm (UTC)
I cannot even begin to imagine hitting, smacking, swatting, flicking, slapping, or verbally abusing my child. Or any child. It injures me to even think about it.
n3m3sis43
Sep. 13th, 2014 11:52 pm (UTC)
OMG, if I even lose my patience and raise my voice, I feel like the worst mommy ever. I don't understand how people abuse their kids.
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 12:47 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - halfshellvenus - Sep. 14th, 2014 05:49 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:56 pm (UTC) - Expand
adoptedwriter
Sep. 13th, 2014 07:46 pm (UTC)
Hey everybody! In the past couple of days I've cleaned house like a fiend, made food, prepped my mom for her trip to FL, taught, tutored and led Zumba.
I just finished a couple of writing tasks and pitched a story/ article to a blog about parenting, which they accepted and will publish. Yay! I write for free and they will promo my book! Cool!

I was never a hitter/ spanner with my kids. I didn't yell insulting names either. I'd lose my license if I did that in the workplace. I can't imagine. I hate seeing parents who react like that out in public in malls, etc.
AW

Edited at 2014-09-13 07:57 pm (UTC)
tatdatcm
Sep. 13th, 2014 08:58 pm (UTC)
I was spanked, infrequently, as a young child, and the wooden spoon was always a threat though rarely employed and if so not so hard that you actually felt it. It was more of an indication that Mom & Dad had reached the end of their rope and you were really in deep doo-doo.

I spanked my kids when they were young, mostly in emergency situations - running into the street, touching something they shouldn't, etc. I don't think I spanked any of them after they were about 5.

I'm a fan of more creative discipline. Like, when the kids would fight with each other, I would make them all sit around a table and hold hands until they got along again. One of my favorite memories is coming home from the store one day to my daughter babysitting her younger brother and her nephew, who are both the same age. The boys were sitting on the sidewalk with scowls on their faces, holding hands. When I asked what was going on, they told me she made them sit there and hold hands until they were done fighting with each other. Parent Win! :)
dmousey
Sep. 14th, 2014 02:44 am (UTC)
That's awesome! I did my bestest to not yell. Most of the time I just spoke in a quiet growly voice... it usually worked. I remember though, I smacked my daughter hard, but it was an automatic reaction because she was spraying lysol in her brother's eyes. They were abiut 6 & 3. Plus I bit my daughter's arm, just hard enough to make an impression, while explaining exasperatedly for the umpteenth time that she couldn't bite other kids, or again, her brother (she loved him I swear). It worked when I told her that's how other kids felt when she did it. Teaching compassion is not easy sometimes.
reckless_blues
Sep. 13th, 2014 09:48 pm (UTC)
Mm. Yeah, I got tossed around a bit when I was a kid too, thrown into walls, choked, that sort of thing. Didn't really feel much different from getting the strap or remote or whatever, they'd chase me down and pin me and just beat me while red-faced and screaming. I have no idea how that affected me - violence is sort of honest to me, it's straightforward and easy to understand, the sexual abuse was worse - but I was a really aggressive person for a while.

I don't really know anything about raising children, I don't have any and I'm probably going to remain single at least until I finish my education, if not longer, I won't mind much if I go through life without a family of my own. But I don't think there's anything wrong with corporal punishment if it's handled correctly. Kids need discipline. An undamaging, straightforward swat is a clear message, maybe it's easier to digest. I know of people who only spank if the kid did something like hit or kick another kid, so that they understand what it means to inflict pain on another person.
bleodswean
Sep. 14th, 2014 12:44 am (UTC)
I know of people who only spank if the kid did something like hit or kick another kid, so that they understand what it means to inflict pain on another person.

But this is the very "logic" that causes confusion, right?
(no subject) - reckless_blues - Sep. 14th, 2014 01:01 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 01:10 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - reckless_blues - Sep. 14th, 2014 01:13 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 01:21 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - reckless_blues - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:16 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:27 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - reckless_blues - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:29 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:39 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - reckless_blues - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:57 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 03:29 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - reckless_blues - Sep. 14th, 2014 04:11 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 14th, 2014 09:18 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:52 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 14th, 2014 03:03 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - bleodswean - Sep. 14th, 2014 03:10 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 14th, 2014 03:18 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - n3m3sis43 - Sep. 14th, 2014 09:13 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dmousey - Sep. 14th, 2014 02:47 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - halfshellvenus - Sep. 14th, 2014 05:53 am (UTC) - Expand
dmousey
Sep. 14th, 2014 03:27 am (UTC)
Here's something I think everyone would appreciate. I'm sorry if we're not supposed to post videos here... but well.. watch... and listen...

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=itvnQ2QB4yc
hosticle_fifer
Sep. 14th, 2014 04:57 am (UTC)
I ...was probably going to save this for an entry, because there's a lot of small complexities around it. My dad used to beat the hell out of me with a piece of firewood with a cutoff nail driven through it. Never the face or head, because he was MUCH more about emotional abuse than physical. Typically it was over grades, or job performance. He stopped doing so entirely when I was about twelve, saying I had gotten too big and might turn on him - with a proud grin over how big and tough I'd gotten. I don't think he ever realized the emotional weight it carried for other people.

He was a speed-fueled, anger-issued, construction-working maniac in the 80's, and himself the son of an *actually* abusive drunkard mountain man in Appalachia.

He's calmed down a lot, gone are the days when I used to blackly swear that he would never meet his grandchildren; now we're like best friends, doing all kinds of stuff together there was little time for when he was working 12-14 hour days. I have conflicting emotions about that part of my childhood, and about whether I would ever engage in corporal punishment of my kids. It'd have to be a pretty serious thing.

Sometimes dad would get drunk, and in a moment of honesty, say, "Son, I was a terrible father. I didn't have a father, so I had no idea what to do. My hope is that I'm a bit better than he was, and that you're a bit better than I was. It takes three generations to recover from alcoholism."

Edited at 2014-09-14 04:58 am (UTC)
hosticle_fifer
Sep. 14th, 2014 03:16 pm (UTC)
Yeeaaahhhh, I had this up but wasn't sure whether to post this. Then later last night I had a good buzz on and decided hell with it, I'll hit the button. I dunno. Sorry for all the melodrama. Nothing like some harsh memories to really liven up the room.
(no subject) - halfshellvenus - Sep. 14th, 2014 04:39 pm (UTC) - Expand
jexia
Sep. 14th, 2014 07:59 am (UTC)
My siblings and I have had that discussion before. We came to the conclusion that if you can laugh about it as an adult, it's "OK". We can laugh about the spankings, and even the time Mum broke a wooden spoon on my sister's butt. Can't laugh about the belt.
dmousey
Sep. 14th, 2014 12:39 pm (UTC)
I understand that one. The thing with my pop was, if he wasn't drinking he was ok. Then again, I remember when he got us out of foster care, we(kids) were alone in our house after school until he came home at 5pm. I knew to have two 'highballs' waiting for him, or 7/7's. Then there was the bar 3doors down on the corner, soooo.... he was drunk, often. When I got older,had kids of my own, I found it easier to understand the pressures he had being a single dad. Couple that with alcohol fueled PTSD from Korean war and you've got a recip for disaster!
Page 1 of 2
<<[1] [2] >>
( 104 comments — Leave a comment )

Profile

LJ Idol
therealljidol
LJ Idol: a writing rollercoaster with iffy brakes

Tags

Powered by LiveJournal.com